Discussion:
End of Season 4
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Seaclock
2003-09-26 17:04:28 UTC
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Was the final episode of season 4 supposed to have been the series
finale? Was the future of season 5 up in the air at that point? I
can't really remember. It seems to have a farewell,
let's-wrap-things-up feel to it (in a way better than the real series
finale did). Everyone was going their separate ways, there was the
sadness of good-byes (but no one was dying), and there's a strong but
not conclusive indication that Dawson and Joey were getting back together.


Seaclock
Oshram
2003-09-26 18:26:33 UTC
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Seaclock asks:

<< Was the final episode of season 4 supposed to have been the series
finale? Was the future of season 5 up in the air at that point?>

If I recall correctly the cast all signed on for five years after the first
season, so they knew the show would be coming back. Plus at that point the
ratings were still acceptable. So I don't think there was any chance of season
four ever possibly being the last season.

<. It seems to have a farewell,
let's-wrap-things-up feel to it (in a way better than the real series
finale did). >

I wasn't thrilled with the finale either; they could have stopped a week early
with Joey in (badly matted) Paris, that would have been okay. But I think with
the season four finale, they were leaving high school, and in a way an era of
the show was ending, and they wanted to give it that feel that the kids were
moving from one phase of life to another. That's why it might have felt more
climactic than other season finales.

<. Everyone was going their separate ways, there was the sadness of good-byes
(but no one was dying),>

You know, while I wasn't overjoyed Jen died, I have to admit, Michelle Williams
gave a hell of a performance in the finale, and her plot was a lot more
interesting than the moronic "which guy will Joey choose?" non-plot.

<.and there's a strong but
not conclusive indication that Dawson and Joey were getting back together.>

Bah. In our dreams. I know more people liked P/J, but that never really made
sense to me. But I've read that Ms. Holmes and Mr. VDB weren't exactly buddies,
so a D/J reunion would have been very unlikely in any event. But it always
would have made more sense to me, anyway.

Oshram
Seaclock
2003-09-26 19:49:27 UTC
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Post by Oshram
I wasn't thrilled with the finale either; they could have stopped a week early
with Joey in (badly matted) Paris,
Some shots were clearly filmed in Montreal. Anyway, that episode had
the same sort of sad feeling though clearly without any kind of love
triangle resolution. The finale seemed strangely disconnected from the
rest of the series. Were we supposed to believe that between the end of
season 6 and this reunion none of them saw or spoke to each other?
That the whole P/J/D problem never came up? The timeline didn't fit the
situation. A ten-year interval would have been more believable for this
kind of separation to occur.
Post by Oshram
You know, while I wasn't overjoyed Jen died, I have to admit, Michelle Williams
gave a hell of a performance in the finale, and her plot was a lot more
interesting than the moronic "which guy will Joey choose?" non-plot.
Hmmm. I liked Jen too much for MW's performance to make her death
acceptable. DC relied an awful lot on death as a plot element, if you
ask me. Yes, I know it happens in real life, but it gets a little stale
as a plot device.
Post by Oshram
<.and there's a strong but
not conclusive indication that Dawson and Joey were getting back together.>
Bah. In our dreams. I know more people liked P/J, but that never really made
sense to me.
To me that's what it really comes down to. P/J were not really a
believable couple. You don't have to like Dawson to see that the whole
series was really geared towards bringing them together in the end, or
at least manipulating the audience into expecting that. I have no
problem with a switch ending where the evidence supports it (see "The
Sixth Sense" or "Murder by Numbers") but in this case the evidence did
not. P/J didn't seem to be happy, or not convincingly so, and there was
an absence of naturalness between them, for lack of a better way to put
it. Look, J & D were established as the primary couple and anyone who's
watched TV knows that it's pretty hard to keep people interested if the
star couple finds happiness early and maintains it. The audience wants
conflict; that's what makes the ultimate reconciliation satisfying. Who
wants to watch six seasons of uneventful bliss? Where's the payoff in
that? The ultimate conflict on this show was boy falls for best
friend's soulmate. It makes for interesting conflict but only if, in
the end, the two soulmates find their way back. Otherwise it's just a
train wreck. Having a J/P ending was someone's idea of a clever twist,
but really it wasn't supportable. (In the interests of reality, the
three of them should have gone their separate ways, in my opinion. Sad
but true, the college years often -- dare I say usually? -- pull even
the closest friendships apart. Acknowledging that fact would have made
for a more touching and interesting reunion than the "who will it be?"
thread.)

Pardon my long-windedness.
Post by Oshram
But I've read that Ms. Holmes and Mr. VDB weren't exactly buddies,
Did anybody like him?
Post by Oshram
so a D/J reunion would have been very unlikely in any event.
I'm sure there are lots of actors who don't get along but who have to
pretend they do for the screen. :)


Seaclock
Oshram
2003-09-29 10:59:40 UTC
Permalink
Seaclock says:

<< Some shots were clearly filmed in Montreal. >>

Oh, I know. And for the most part that was just fine. The bit with the Eiffel
tower was a tad much, that's all. The rest of it was completely acceptable.

<.Anyway, that episode had
the same sort of sad feeling though clearly without any kind of love
triangle resolution.>

Precisely what I liked about the pre-finale episode. You got the sense that
some changes had been made, that some growth was still to occur, but the book
was left dramatically wide open. I found it a more satisfying ending than the
finale.

<. The finale seemed strangely disconnected from the rest of the series. Were
we supposed to believe that between the end of
season 6 and this reunion none of them saw or spoke to each other?
That the whole P/J/D problem never came up? The timeline didn't fit the
situation. A ten-year interval would have been more believable for this
kind of separation to occur.>

I agree with much of the above. I can accept that friends from high school
drifted apart after college, because most often they do. Ten years would have
been better but I think a) the actors might have looked a bit young for thirty,
and b) most people move on significantly with their lives in ten years. Five
years is less time to move on, find a spouse, etc.


<.I liked Jen too much for MW's performance to make her death
acceptable. DC relied an awful lot on death as a plot element, if you
ask me. Yes, I know it happens in real life, but it gets a little stale
as a plot device.>

You're not wrong. I liked Jen, but I felt esp. in season six they didn't have
anything for her (or Jack) to do, really, and it surprised me they both gave
such strong performances in the finale. And let's face it; without Jen's death,
you don't *have* a plot. At least Williamson was shrewd enough to realize that
you couldn't just foist two hours of "who will Joey choose?" on people. I'll
grant you that character death is a much overused plot cliche on TV, but in
this instance I'll forgive them as it was done unusually well.

<.To me that's what it really comes down to. P/J were not really a
believable couple. >

Sadly, most fans would argue with you. And in the Season 1 commentary
Williamson even says they were on the drawing board for later on down the road.
I thought some of what they did together was okay, but honestly I felt Gina
Fattore put them to rest for good in 'Castaways.' Handled nicely, tied up the
loose ends, explained why they wouldn't work in the long run.

<.You don't have to like Dawson to see that the whole
series was really geared towards bringing them together in the end,>

Certainly early on, on the first two seasons, everything was geared toward
that. And it just made more sense.

<.or
at least manipulating the audience into expecting that. >

Yeah, many not-so-subtle 'fake-outs' in the finale.

<.P/J didn't seem to be happy, or not convincingly so, and there was
an absence of naturalness between them, for lack of a better way to put
it. >

What irked me in the finale is that here we are five years later and everyone
has moved on except Pacey, who's still a lech and still whining about how he's
nothing without Joey -- the same mantra he was shilling at nineteen. Grow up
already, Pace.

<.Look, J & D were established as the primary couple and anyone who's
watched TV knows that it's pretty hard to keep people interested if the
star couple finds happiness early and maintains it. >

It is true that you can mine more dramatic tension from the promise of a couple
or an unhappy couple than you can from a settled one, sure.

<.The ultimate conflict on this show was boy falls for best
friend's soulmate. It makes for interesting conflict but only if, in
the end, the two soulmates find their way back. >

You'll find no arguments here.

<. Having a J/P ending was someone's idea of a clever twist,
but really it wasn't supportable. >

It wasn't all that clever a twist, actually; they forecast it early on in the
finale. But actually plotwise Pacey *has* to get Joey in the finale. Dawson has
his life; he has other things to do. Pacey has essentially nothing without
Joey. So Dawson gets to be Williamson, and Pacey gets the girl. I don't agree
with the logic, but I think that was sort of what was going through their
minds.

<. (In the interests of reality, the
three of them should have gone their separate ways, in my opinion. Sad
but true, the college years often -- dare I say usually? -- pull even
the closest friendships apart. Acknowledging that fact would have made
for a more touching and interesting reunion than the "who will it be?"
thread.)>

I agree 100%. But reality doesn't intrude nearly as much as it should in many
dramas.
Pardon my long-windedness.>
No need to pardon eloquence.


<.I'm sure there are lots of actors who don't get along but who have to
pretend they do for the screen. :)>

Absolutely. But stars on TV shows can make demands, and they are often met in
the interests of placating the fans. And if, say, both Katie and VDB didn't
want it, well...

Oshram

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